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Thread: From The Choirgirl Hotel Remaster/Re-issue [Cancelled]

  1. #436
    Senior Member grapefruit_is_winning's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by nosferatu View Post
    ."Mark can you learn to play the cello,violin and harp by next Tuesday please!!! I'm starting to get new ideas for the next record !!!"
    Ha

  2. #437
    Robbing the muse... Beelust's Avatar
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    Love this discussion.

    Mark definitely did not pressure Tori into motherhood though. There are interviews back from 93 and 94 where Tori yearns to have a child with Eric and take a break from music. I think it’s in Tori - it’s always been there. She has an innate “motherly love” and wisdom to share with others - and naturally acts as a mother to her listeners and fans, spending so much time and sharing love at meet and greets and changing up every one of the 1500 plus shows she’s performed live to tell a new story. She is on another level.

    I tried to love TBK, ADP & AATS when they were released. I think Give has the most listens (over 500) on my iTunes because I was trying to understand the music and what had happened to Tori.

    The changes in sound growing as a musician through LE, UTP, BFP, FTCH, TVAB, SLG, and SW is incredible. They are all amazing albums. Then three almost embarrassing albums (to some - I know others love them).

    I don’t blame Mark. I think it is more natural hormone changes becoming a mother and becoming less selfish and giving her all for another being. She did not know what to sing about anymore. So we got scorpions, knickers, sexy trust, suburbia rants, girls with butterflies and my little ponys, it goes on and on - TBK is the oddest in her catalog for me. The lyrics are so bizarre compared to anything that came before.

    Then I think Tori noted her mistake with TBK, tried to overcompensate with multiple forced sounds on ADP... then when that did not help sales, became depresssed with AATS. I think Midwinter Graces was actually a triumph for Tori and helped her on the right track / created interest with Deutche Grammaphone for the lovely NOH and the wonderful UG and NI.

    I’m rambling. Just saying I dont think it’s Mark but just a star losing touch as technology changed and she had Tash at the turn of the century.
    Last edited by Beelust; 08-10-2018 at 08:19 PM.
    Robbing the muse...

  3. #438
    Senior Member skyscape's Avatar
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    I'm late to the conversation, but I'm not disappointed by the fact that FTCH won't be re-released, I think it's fine as it is.

    There are lots of references in the recent posts here to Botox, surgery, dietary control etc - it seems as though the ADP/AATS period was one of turmoil for Tori, and none of us can judge her; if we were in her position, who knows what surgeries we'd use to get us to a place where we felt confident to go on stage? But I never thought Tori would succumb to that pressure, I always felt she gave us a message of self-acceptance no matter what, but she did, and whilst I don't stand in judgment of her, I truly believe that the music has been affected by the crisis. When she sings in 'Oysters' - So can these shoes take me to, to Who I was before', I wonder does she pen the regret we assume she might feel?

  4. #439
    Threat level: Bitch in a wheelchair andy's Avatar
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    I don't think the original person who said it said that Mark forced Tori to choose. I mean, even if he did want Tori to be a mother first, she's the breadwinner and in their professional life he is essentially her employee, there would be no money to raise a child if it weren't for her work as an artist. However, I think Tori herself has made it clear, both in Piece by Piece and other interviews that while she fought hard to be a mother she struggled with the transition at some points. I wouldn't be surprised if her mental health issues/potential depression or whatever was tied into postpartum, life style changes around that that affected her life and her marriage. There was definitely a rebalancing she had to work at and perhaps she even felt guilt about her workaholism as a mother. Of course she put Tash's needs first, but to continue touring, promotion, producing work, taking time every day to write and play, that is not a normal woman's experience of motherhood. That change along with marital strife, the death of her brother, health issues, I'm surprised and in fact proud of her for working through it all at the level that she did. Something had to give and it was most likely her relationship with her fans and the public. She withdrew from us vocally, lyrically, she changed her outward appearance to separate herself from 'the woman we call Tori', and further even by giving us the dolls, and did what she could to still remain relevant in a tumultuous industry that judges women by how they look (I can't imagine that pressure - wasn't it also theorised at the time that the dolls were in part to allow her hair to recover from years of dyeing?). I think we all agree she could have benefited from more time away, but it's also probable that that would have left her even more unhappy.

    Here's a quote from 2001:

    I realized you cannot put her needs and your needs first at the same time. There is no negotiating on that one. I didn’t have the patience before to get baby behavior. You have to watch them every second. And it takes a lot to play blocks for five hours. Parenthood isn’t for everyone. For some people, it’s animals or traveling or being out on the ocean. Whatever it is, there’s that thing that opens up these windows for you where everything lines up. Alternative Press - October 2001
    Anyway. I know it's creepy to ruminate on this stuff a lot - but since we're talking about Tori's difficult few years with a sense of understanding and respect as opposed to "Look at that bitch in a shake and go Party City wig singing about throwing herself off a cliff in 1000s of dollars worth of couture." Now she's through it, I'm glad we can see the struggle she faced and bring the correct level of respect to it with hindsight.
    Last edited by andy; 08-10-2018 at 10:55 PM.

  5. #440
    Threat level: Bitch in a wheelchair andy's Avatar
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    My how times have changed:


  6. #441
    Senior Member Nick's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cunter Fartlett View Post
    Barnes & Noble also releases B&N Exclusive vinyl. They press soundtracks, musical cast recordings, greatest hits, compilations, re-releases and live records. They released Ben Folds Sessions at West 54, and exclusive 7" single sets from Beatles and Sun Records. Just off the top of my head. So, it could very well be some kind of recording.
    I assume she is talking about a book, so I don't think that's the B&N project. But I just realized the Sessions release for Ben Folds has his whole 15 song set on double vinyl! When Beth Orton released her Sessions recordings it was just the songs they broadcast on TV, so I assumed the same was true of Ben. I would kill for the rest of Tori's set, since the songs they broadcast are (to me) peak live Tori and it sounded like a really excellent day for her and the band. Screw the Choirgirl Remaster if she ever gives us this full set!

    Precious Things
    iieee
    Past the Mission
    Caught a Lite Sneeze
    Pandora's Aquarium (not broadcast)
    Take to the Sky (solo)
    Hey Jupiter (solo) (not broadcast)
    Northern Lad (not broadcast)
    Crucify (not broadcast)
    Spark (not broadcast)
    The Waitress
    Encore:
    Cooling (solo)
    Raspberry Swirl (not broadcast)
    Cornflake Girl (not broadcast)

  7. #442
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nick View Post
    I assume she is talking about a book, so I don't think that's the B&N project. But I just realized the Sessions release for Ben Folds has his whole 15 song set on double vinyl! When Beth Orton released her Sessions recordings it was just the songs they broadcast on TV, so I assumed the same was true of Ben. I would kill for the rest of Tori's set, since the songs they broadcast are (to me) peak live Tori and it sounded like a really excellent day for her and the band. Screw the Choirgirl Remaster if she ever gives us this full set!

    Precious Things
    iieee
    Past the Mission
    Caught a Lite Sneeze
    Pandora's Aquarium (not broadcast)
    Take to the Sky (solo)
    Hey Jupiter (solo) (not broadcast)
    Northern Lad (not broadcast)
    Crucify (not broadcast)
    Spark (not broadcast)
    The Waitress
    Encore:
    Cooling (solo)
    Raspberry Swirl (not broadcast)
    Cornflake Girl (not broadcast)
    That would be a great opportunity to give fans the Choirgirl fix they really want

  8. #443
    strike every chord that you feel Owen's Avatar
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    HOLY CRAP why was that never fully released and broadcast? Please, Tori. Please. *begs*

  9. #444
    megaphone to my chest MikeEP's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nick View Post
    I assume she is talking about a book, so I don't think that's the B&N project. But I just realized the Sessions release for Ben Folds has his whole 15 song set on double vinyl! When Beth Orton released her Sessions recordings it was just the songs they broadcast on TV, so I assumed the same was true of Ben. I would kill for the rest of Tori's set, since the songs they broadcast are (to me) peak live Tori and it sounded like a really excellent day for her and the band. Screw the Choirgirl Remaster if she ever gives us this full set!

    Precious Things
    iieee
    Past the Mission
    Caught a Lite Sneeze
    Pandora's Aquarium (not broadcast)
    Take to the Sky (solo)
    Hey Jupiter (solo) (not broadcast)
    Northern Lad (not broadcast)
    Crucify (not broadcast)
    Spark (not broadcast)
    The Waitress
    Encore:
    Cooling (solo)
    Raspberry Swirl (not broadcast)
    Cornflake Girl (not broadcast)
    such a good point about the unaired songs. why do you assume it's a book though? I actually thought it was more likely a music release based on the comments from that Light Princess event, though it was hard to tell what context she said it in.

  10. #445
    strike every chord that you feel Owen's Avatar
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    Does Tori even know it exists, is the question? Her live releases have consistently baffled me. Sessions floored me when it first aired. We had a string of great live performances in 90-99 actually. Sessions, Hard Rock, Storytellers, PPV. All incredible.

  11. #446
    your veil is quietly becoming none roominmyheart's Avatar
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    Her awareness might be the main roadblock. I still think we need to compile a written list of live recordings we would love to have released (maybe voted on by fans via social media) that's presented to her either at a M&G or by one of our resident interviewers (if willing, of course). I think she needs these things written down for her, as even just asking her about them hasn't seemed to work.

  12. #447
    strike every chord that you feel Owen's Avatar
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    I think that's a lovely idea, as long as it is done respectfully and with love. In all seriousness, I have no ill will towards Tori for not releasing these things BUT the love and happiness it would bring would be immense!

  13. #448
    Well guess what Mimi, WE DID. Octopussy's Avatar
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    I would put Sessions and Hard Rock Live on the high priority list. She apparently hated doing Storytellers, and she would probably be embarrassed by the "mistakes" and the "EAT MY PUSSY" bit during the Las Vegas show. So I wouldn't hold my breath for either of those.

    Also ---> East Lansing MI is the show that was filmed for the '98 DVD, if I remember correctly, and a few of those songs ended up on Venus Live. A full-length audio release would be doable... maybe? For '99, there were much better shows than Vegas. I would rather get a show from the non-Alanis leg. But even with the shorter sets, there were better versions of Blood Roses, and IMO the best Father Lucifer ever performed was in Nashville on her birthday. It had a very long and witchy improv at the beginning. If nothing else, add that version to the request list PLEASE!

  14. #449
    Robbing the muse... Beelust's Avatar
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    I know we all want this - but I don't see these old shows being released. Montreux was released because that was Tori starting out back in 91/92.
    I would sooner expect a 2014/2017 live release rather than a 98/99 live performance. Unless she is planning on releasing a number of live shows from throughout the years via B & N...
    Robbing the muse...

  15. #450
    strike every chord that you feel Owen's Avatar
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    Don't rain on my paraaaade!
    Last edited by Owen; 08-15-2018 at 07:18 PM.

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